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The Tuesday afternoon "Open Forum" will begin promptly at 4 Atlantic/CANADA, 3 p.m. Eastern, 2 p.m. Central, 1 p.m. Mountain, and noon Pacific. While you wait for the "Open Forum" to start, feel free to use your ASK A QUESTION button RIGHT BETWEEN THE YELLOW "MAP" AND THE RED QUESTION MARK IN ICHAT to post some questions for the discussion group.

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While we're waiting, here's a Word Play for today:..

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Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.

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Here's another feature called "Why English is so Hard"--this is #1:...

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The bandage was wound around the wound. (-:]

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Good afternoon! Welcome to this Tuesday afternoon's "Open Forum" session. I'm your moderator, Mel Boring, and the Web Editor for this site. We're back for an informal time of answering any questions you might like to ask, on any subject. So feel free to ask what's on your mind--and I'll tell you what's on mine! First, please read these announcements, then we'll get started.

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IMPORTANT INSTRUCTIONS: Send questions you'd like answered or discussed by using your "Ask a Question" icon/button. (It looks like a thought bubble icon, RIGHT NEXT TO THE RED QUESTION MARK.) The moderator (me, Mel Boring) will post the questions one at a time in the chat room and do my best to answer them.

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WARNING: If you don't post anything at all, SOME of you will be bounced off the system in 15 minutes. TO PREVENT THIS, type something (either a question to the moderator or even a private message) every 15 minutes to stay active and remain online.

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First, I have a couple of announcements about things I've been told about that I wanted to pass on to YOU....

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This FIRST one verges on a "joke," but it is TRUE, a job opportunity:...

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Help Wanted - Join the Welburn Gourd Farm Team!

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If you have a passion for gourds and outstanding writing skills, you

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definitely want to see this job opportunity! Click on the link below to

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view, AOL users please copy and past the link in your browser.

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http://www.welburngourdfarm.com/jobposting.htm

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That is a SERIOUS writing job offered on the Internet folks--any takers?...

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Here is also a new magazine submission opportunity:...

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www.confetti-celebration.com...

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Go to that URL to see CONFETTI MAGAZINE, a new mag that is wanting submissions. I checked it out briefly, it looks good....

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Here's a new book highly recommended by the recommender:...

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Les Edgerton's new book - FINDING YOUR VOICE - is quite marvelous. And even though it's written for writers of adult fiction, I think it's something that children's writers can also benefit from enormously. The best I've read on the subject of how to put personality into your work! Shelley Malka

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Finally, here is a statement by Harold Underdown about getting an agent, from his OWN personal experience:...

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Actually it can be MORE difficult to find an agent than a publisher.

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I've been talking to agents and artist's reps as part of the

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research for the revised edition of my Complete Idiot's Guide to

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Publishing Children's Books (I'm almost done and the revision should

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be out in January).

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They are all telling me that their doors are essentially closed. The

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best strategy seems to be to get some publishing credits, get

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involved with writer's groups and network, and gradually work

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towards making personal contacts... Yes, a long-term process.

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There's an article on agents with useful basic information on my web

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site, The Purple Crayon, at http://www.underdown.org/articles.htm

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So if YOU think it's tough getting an agent, THAT's Harold Underdown's present problem TOO!

boris

A few years ago I purchased copyright's on all my ms's......

boris

A few years ago I purchased copyright's on all my ms's......

boris

but since then I've made several changes to those ms's......

boris

are the copyright's still valid on those books with the ....

boris

changes?

boris

I know now that I didn't really have to get the copyrights..

boris

but at the time I didn't know that.

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No, boris, the original copyrights would not hold for the changes....

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BUT it's really simple, as you probably know,...

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to copyright the NEW version yourself....

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Just put the copyright symbol in the upper-right corner of page 1, with the YEAR, then your NAME after it....

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By the newest copyright law, it WILL be copyrighted from the SECOND you do that!

Composer

Composer: A recent submission I sent to Jack and Jill Magazine was returned stating, "Good inspiration, but not needed right now." Does that mean I should resubmit my manuscript at another time? Or is it just their way to tell me they're NOT interested?

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NO, Composer, their response does NOT mean they are not interested. Magazines get overloaded with supplies of stories and/or articles from time to time, and have no way to "store" more. So they honestly tell submitters this. YES, it would be a GOOD idea for you to submit it again, in about six months.

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This was one of the questions I picked up off my OLD and accumulated e-mails AFTER my webmail started working again....

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I will interject some of these from time to time--and they are GOOD ones I think we'll ALL benefit from.

skigirl

How do you contact a book packager to write for a series?

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If you have ICL's CHILDREN'S BOOK MARKET, skigirl,...

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look through the listings to pick out the FEW that are book PACKAGERS,...

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Then there will be a contact person and address for them....

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Write to that person and ask. They may say in the listing to send samples or resume or such....

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Second suggestion, skigirl: Go to www.scbwi.org,...

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the URL of the Society of Children's Book Writers and Illustrators,...

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and they MIGHT have info about book packagers....

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Also, you MIGHT need to join SCBWI to do that. It costs a year, and it is WELL worth it, in my opinion....'

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Does ANYone here know of a book packaging company you could give us the NAME of? I'll be glad to pass them on!

lila

Should 1st-time authors get an agent?

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Hi, lila! It would be a MIRACLE, probably, if a first-timer got an agent....

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Agents only take on those with some kind of track record in publishing....

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That doesn't mean you can't try,...

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but it's a bit like a person who wants to be a carpenter,...

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and goes out to get jobs withOUT the experience of carpentering....

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Agents want you to be experienced in publishing....

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By the way, a GOOD listing of agents is in the annual tome, LITERARY MARKET PLACE....

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In that annual big book is a section that lists bona fide agents, ones you can trust....

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P.S., lila: SOME agents MAY take on a first-timer, but they will ask for a "reading fee" just to read your manuscript....

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Say NO to those kind, because bona fide agents DON'T charge--unless it be for postage in sending things out for you, or phone calls made on your behalf to sell your books....

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A P.P.S. to this: Agents don't usually want to be bothered handling MAGAZINE stories and articles.

EW

I have used fifteen books to find reference material. If I were to use quotation marks and footnotes for everything, I think it would look cluttered, and would confuse the reader. How is credit given to the referenced material without footnotes and quotations?

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I think the answer I had prepared is not coming through....

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There are a couple of ways to give references for our quotes and other used material....

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First, a small, raised number is put by the quote or the fact used,...

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Then the numbers are listed EITHER at the ends of the chapters OR at the end of the entire book,...

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and by each of the numbers is the source, which will give the title,...

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the author, the publisher and the year of publication of the source you got that quote from....

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Those references may ALL be listed at the END of the book, too, in the same way,...

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except that ALL of them are given in what's sometimes called a BIBLIOGRAPHY, or may be called SOURCES.

skigirl

Is it difficult to get an assignment to write for a series?

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It isn't difficult, skigirl, IF you've had some writing experience....

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But MOST established series want writers who are either published themselves, or have had experience in writing....

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On the other hand, if your writing SAMPLE they might ask you to submit for the series...

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is a knockout, there's no doubt they would hire you. So, TRY, go for it!

lizr

SCBWI has a downloadable .pdf of lists and addresses on book packagers. I discovered that *many* on the list are no lonnger in the book packaing business = (

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THANK YOU, lizr!!!...

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Book packagers come and go with the times....

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In times when books are NOT selling well, book packagers hope to help...

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by offering publishers a cheaper means of getting books out....

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What the usual book packager does is to put together a list of books they can provide to a publisher,...

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by enlisting us writers to write a book for a list the packager thinks will sell....

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The packager presents the books to a publisher, who may be ALL or NONE on the list....

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In GOOD-selling book times, however, the niche for book packagers shrinks....

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But I'm sure there will be SOME in business today.

nkk

Can we mention being a student at ICL in the cover letter?

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I wouldn't do it, nkk. Because you want to come across as a PROFESSIONAL, ...

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not as a writer who is still preparing to write....

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I know you feel like you want to have SOME recommendation behind you, but...

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don't mention any courses you're taking; you'll probably shoot yourself in the foot.

lizr

re Book Packagers - a woman in my weekly writer's group works for a few educational book packagers - it was took a while for her to break and she was a teacher - you can do a google search and find some.

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THANKS again, lizr! What I'll do later today is do an Internet search and see what I can find also for you....

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Then I'll report back on my findings next Tuesday.

BM

Although I have been freelancing for some time now, I will soon be writing a column for the very first time for a weekly magazine. Are there any tips and guidelines you could give me with regard to style, form etc. that a columnist should follow?

RT

How can I get an agent interested in my work?

RF

If an editor asks for photos can you send digital photos and what is the procedure?

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IMPORTANT INSTRUCTIONS: Send questions you'd like answered or discussed by using your "Ask a Question" icon/button. (It looks like a thought bubble icon, RIGHT NEXT TO THE RED QUESTION MARK.) The moderator (me, Mel Boring) will post the questions one at a time in the chat room and do my best to answer them.

BG

How would a beginning writer plan his first novel? Would you start free associating, maybe?

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The best way to plan and start your first novel, BG, is much as you have put it: Free Association. What I do first, is write down on a sheet of paper, or however many it takes, ALL of my bits and pieces of ideas about the novel. They might include characters' names, settings that the story takes place in, and pieces of plot ideas. Second then, I pull from these "bits and pieces" an outline of the novel as much as I can outline it thus far. The outline will of course be very incomplete because you will be developing that outline AS YOU WRITE the novel, changing it constantly. When I have the outline as done as it can be done for starters, I start sketchily writing out the first chapter, continuing to develop my outline as I write. Then I move on to the second chapter, and so on.

CC

Is there any limit on the time it should take for poetry to be published?

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No different limits than the time it takes for fiction or nonfiction to be published, CC.

oscar

I'm trying to publish a multi-cultural story . Suggestions?

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First of all, oscar, multicultural stories have been the IN THING for some years,...

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and I heard one editor comment that SHE thought they would be IN forever,...

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because of our world "shrinking" and the need to learn about other cultures, other peoples....

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I would look in the magazine or book guide you use, ...

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and under what the publication or editor wants, they will list MULTICULTURAL, and GO for THOSE!

izzy

Can you say you graduated from ICL?

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Probably not a good idea either, izzy....

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NOT because ICL has a bad reputation, because their reputation is good....

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But MOST editors are looking for MUCH-published writers, ...

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so ANYthing about going to writing school, or even HAVING gone to writing school, will not impress them for GOOD.

nkk

can u post a sample coverletter on the web?

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GREAT idea, nkk! I don't have one right here, but I will FIND one on the web...

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If ANYone KNOWs of one on the Internet, can you let me know here, please?

amadillo

What should I take into consideration when I am looking.....

amadillo

...when looking for a good proof-reader

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A good proofreader is MOST-important, a very THOROUGH person, amadillo....

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So look for a person who, EVEN in their personal habits, is very THOROUGH....

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Secondly, you want someone with EXPERIENCE in proofreading, to know they have DONE the job for other writers....

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May I suggest that you try one of your writing friends, or a person in a writing group you might belong to?...

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Oftentimes, they can be of GOOD help because they will be thorough because they are your FRIEND of colleague--and may do it for free or exchange.

gira

I know a couple of people who have published their own books

gira

and they are selling, what do you think of this?

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I think the KEY to publishing your own books is PUBLICIZING them, gira,...

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and if this is done, self-publishing is a good way to go....

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Actually, there are SOME PUBLISHERS who have a reputation for not publicizing books very well....

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So YOU could maybe do a better job than they at publicizing, letting people KNOW about your books....

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What that amounts to is STORAGE of large quantities of your books somewhere,...

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and also, driving about from place to place to either SELL them yourself--at fairs or garage sales or flea markets to sell them....

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It may also mean PHONING to contact people who might be able to help, either in selling, or stocking your books....

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It CAN be successful, as you know from your friend!

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Here's a VERY entertaining comment about not telling editors you're a writing school grad: (-:}

mrsmouse

Hmmmph. Not fair. DOCTORS can hang their diplomas.

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THANK YOU mrsmouse for a GOOD chuckle!

izzy

do editors forget you mentioned that in the past?

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Yes, izzy. Most editors I've known have GOOD memories,...

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but they won't remember unimportant details like "izzy said she was an ICL grad."

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By the by, I WANT to mention, because I've been asked....

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WHAT the limitations are if you are here in the chat room using JAVA or JAVA LITE instead of the Ichat...

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The BIGgest limitation is that you can't send the WHOLE question at once,...

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you're limited...

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to little pieces...

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like this!...

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DON'T WORRY about it. I MIGHT put them all together, or just put the pieces on one at a time....

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I UNDERSTAND, and it's perfectly alright, friends!

nkk

do you know a magazine that accepts rhyming text fiction

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No I don't, offhand, nkk, without looking through a submissions guide....

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because there are SO FEW that do accept rhyming, even poetry....

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This SEEMS like a paradox, because we ALL know how popular Dr. Seuss's and Shel Silverstein's poetic fiction and poems ARE,...

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but I think because editors have seen so much DOGGEREL, forced poetry and such, that they shy away from it.

amadillo

Does an editor see it as a plus or a disadvantage when....

amadillo

...you have two or three scenes in your book that have.....

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I'm sorry that the last part of the question broke off...

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And I can't seem to get the question box back up here....

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But amadillo, what you're asking is about scenes that are similar to other books....

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And NO, I don't think that would be a disadvantage to a publisher....

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In fact, if the scenes are similar to those in books that are popular,...

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I think that could be an ADVANTAGE for you!

Marion Q

What makes an outstanding query letter? Would it help to include a pre-printed post card with boxes to check off (such as ___ Please send story; ___ Do not send; ___ Other)?

NK

I have just finished assignment one, and would like to try and send it out for submission. Is it too early for me to submit? If not, what should I mention in the cover letter, because I have not published before? Should I mention that I am a student at ICL?

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As an ICL instructor for 18 years, I SELDOM recommended that any student submit their first assignment. As your instructor would probably agree, that assignment is simply for assessment, so that your instructor can know your writing abilities from the start. And very few first assignments turn out to be submittable, NK. Also, mentioning that you are a student ANYwhere would not be a good idea in a cover letter. Let the editors THINK that you are experienced—that won't hurt you!

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Both the time and the questions and answers flew by FAST you may not have gotten them, so if you want a copy of the transcript of this Open Forum,

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DO e-mail me at: webeditor@institutechildrenslit.com

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And I can send you one. That way, you'll have a chance to read the Q&A's at a more leisurely pace....

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THANKS for being here today, and I hope to "see you again" next Tuesday at Open Forum!

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BYE for now!